new NIN songs and the new industry standard...

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Re: new NIN songs and the new industry standard...

Postby Jaggedone » Mon Apr 06, 2009 4:31 pm

Certainly good points made there and I'm still waiting for my f.....g shirts ordered from their site \:x\ \
Although there are a couple of bands who bridged that generation gap i.e. as mentioned Metallica, ACDC, Iron Maiden, to name just a few, I still sell mega Metallica, Maiden and ACDC shirts to very young guns. But they are more populist, main stream metal / rock bands and KJ remain pure cult status, which for me personally, ist viel viel besser!! Have a nice Punch Up and nice evening / JO \;)\
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Re: new NIN songs and the new industry standard...

Postby cyrilgrey » Sat Apr 11, 2009 3:07 pm

Jaggedone wrote:Why is Disturbed more popular than KJ \;)\
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the question was "why is Disturbed worth more than Killing Joke?". I was not talking as a talent- i was talking in terms of Disturbed's CD Single being only 3 years-old, while the Killing Joke CD Singles have been out-of-print for 15 years, yet you can still find the KJ stuff for $10. Your answer still fits though-- Disturbed is a lot more... present and accessible, so, as with the NIN stuff, it is more "in demand". It wasn't that i did not know the reasons, it's just kind of like in an A+B=C sense. You do the math, and because the KJ is older and it should be harder to find, it should be worth more, but that's not how it works. Kinda my whole point; you cann't second guess this stuff. it's hard to say "oh, i'd better buy lots of those because they'll be worth hundreds soon." because you can't really know. how many Distubed fans would have expected a CD Single for a cover of someone else's song would be worth this much in only 3 years...
"you make a prison of my life, if you became another's wife. With all the prisons blown to dust, my enemies walk free- I'm mad about you"
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Re: new NIN songs and the new industry standard...

Postby Jaggedone » Sun Apr 12, 2009 10:15 am

Evaluating and quantifying why certain things are the way they are is part of our pysche, but acceptance of the fact that market forces determine the price of things is the ultimate answer. Albeit, if they were to utilise KJ songs for a popular film soundtrack for example, then that would create demand for KJ material, past and present automatically forcing the prices up. Control about Ian/Joy divison created a brand new global interest in the band and plenty of JD stuff is now available, re -recorded, re - digitalised, repackaged and hence the high prices for their material \:cry:\ ! I love sonic Youth and their masterpieces are available for peanuts \:lol:\ Good subject by the way!JO
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Re: new NIN songs and the new industry standard...

Postby Whiplash » Wed Apr 15, 2009 1:47 am

Disturbed (a shining light in the not so nu metal scene by the way!)\
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What!!!!! They are washed up and done. Mainstream bullshit metal is a better label for Disturbed. They sucked back when they started and suck even more now. \
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NIN is a KLASSSSS band and became huge. I think KJ could have gone the same route as them if not bigger, but comparing the two now is absurd. One thing NIN did better than KJ ever did is work hard and tour. Touring is what makes a band. In order to release free stuff you need to be willing to tour. This is where bands make money anyway, not off record sales or internet sales.
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Re: new NIN songs and the new industry standard...

Postby cyrilgrey » Thu Apr 16, 2009 2:51 am

I'm not comparing the music output, but rather the marketing (at least, that's the way i started the post). It's already being put into effect with a lot of major labels-- the "release 1 or 2 songs a month" standard. NIN is just cool in that they throw out "freebees" every now and again, but the main point is Killing Joke should start getting into the practice of internet releasing using old or new material.
"you make a prison of my life, if you became another's wife. With all the prisons blown to dust, my enemies walk free- I'm mad about you"
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Re: new NIN songs and the new industry standard...

Postby Jaggedone » Thu Apr 16, 2009 4:59 pm

[quote="Whiplash"]Disturbed (a shining light in the not so nu metal scene by the way!)\
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What!!!!! They are washed up and done. Mainstream bullshit metal is a better label for Disturbed. They sucked back when they started and suck even more now. \
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Whip my man, I have had these discussions many times and the only thing that matters (Metallica line there!) is everybody has their own personal tastes. If your opinion about Disturbed is as you mention, so be it, I have absolutely no problems there.\
But the facts speak different away from one's own subjective tastes. \
All four CD's have gone platinum, they sell out concerts all over the planet and have a dedicated following. Their last work, Indestructable topped the billboard US charts and was numero uno in many other countries. \
They are currently on a US/European tour and are selling out venues non - stop. I will be seeing them for the fifth time and on a personal note, can't wait!\
I respect everybodies opinions and different tastes and never would I call even Coldplay crap or washed out, even though I absolutely detest their music!\
There was never on this particualr thread comparisons with NIN/Disturbed or our fab KJ, that is a complete and utter misinterpretation of this thread.\
Just imagine if we all had the same tastes, life would be a fucking bore and everybody should have the right to express his or her opinions without having to suffer any form of insults or subjective rants from our beloved KJ followers! JO \;)\
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Re: new NIN songs and the new industry standard...

Postby Whiplash » Thu Apr 16, 2009 11:55 pm

Jag, Yes you are right Disturbed has achieved tremendous commercial success, but I still think they suck and that's my opinion. Also, there are comparisons between NIN/Disturbed and KJ in the forms in which they market them selves in this thread so actually I am not "utterly misinterpreting the thread" as you say. Maybe a little bit, but "utterly"\
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"I'm not comparing the music output, but rather the marketing (at least, that's the way i started the post)".\
" they are more populist, main stream metal / rock bands and KJ remain pure cult status"\
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Many other examples of comparisons also so you get my point.\
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Not a big deal Jag, but I think you are overreacting to my opinion and if I didn't word eloquently so as to not offend you I apologize, but it purely was my opinion. \:)\
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Re: new NIN songs and the new industry standard...

Postby Jaggedone » Fri Apr 17, 2009 3:07 pm

[quote="Whiplash"]Jag, Yes you are right Disturbed has achieved tremendous commercial success, but I still think they suck and that's my opinion.\
No problem, I'm old enough to understand fully where you are coming from and with your opinion/taste no problem either.\
These taste discussions on some forums lead sometimes to brutal, insulting and very futile cyber battles and I'm not interested in that. \
I love being here amongst true KJ'ers and only hope I can bring some other, positive, impulses amongst you all!\
Respect man and I always was slightly disturbed anyway, even before Disturbed were formed \;)\
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Re: new NIN songs and the new industry standard...

Postby cyrilgrey » Mon Apr 20, 2009 12:49 am

That's such a great point: if we all had the same exact taste, it would all be rather boring. I love chatting with fellow KJ fans and then have one of them throw out a band I detest (see, I like Disturbed AND Coldplay, soo..) and that talk to that person. Try to understand how we could both love such a great band, yet disagree totally on the other. Or when Sapromind-- he always has "listening to..." on the bottom of his posts, and 9 times out of 10, the songs are excellent: NIN, the Cure, Tool, etc., but then once in a while he'll post something I've never heard of (something for me to check out) or something I don't like, and sometimes, the reason I don't like them has nothing to do with talent, but old prejudices that I've held on to since high school- like in high school, you were a psuedo-hippy if you listened to Dave Matthews, but I've since let go of that belief and I actually enjoy some of his work. So, I agree 100%-- ok, maybe 98%... that different tastes make this place far more interesting. Having said all that, I don't agree with the sales argument only because, outside of my rerspected KJ fan circle, most of the world has terrible taste in music, so sales prove nothing more than there are a lot of people out there who believe they should like band X...
"you make a prison of my life, if you became another's wife. With all the prisons blown to dust, my enemies walk free- I'm mad about you"
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Re: new NIN songs and the new industry standard...

Postby Jaggedone » Mon Apr 20, 2009 10:10 am

True, record sales determine the sometimes disgraceful tastes the majority of people have a lá Macdonalds effect!\
Nevermind (Nirvana) that's the way the world is, I can live with that!\
Buy Joy Division/Sonic Youth/Velvet Underground/Iggy Pop and get some great pleasure, or maybe you already have?JO \;)\
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